Comment on Council removes almost 1,000 flags from Derby streets

• Zombie@feddit.uk ⁨2⁩ ⁨days⁩ ago

  benefit from Barnett consequentials

  And you said you’re from Aberdeen?..

  Jesus Christ. When was the last time you saw the gold paved streets of the silver city? It’s really benefited immensely from 50 years of oil wealth! It’s just swimming in money. Union Street definitely isn’t in disrepair and filled with bookies and the like… It has so much money it’s decided to open 5 more libraries just for a laugh, none have shut down, honest.

  If you think Barnett is a net benefit to Scotland then I’ve got a bridge to sell you. This isn’t an emotive issue, it’s an issue of self determination. About getting a chance at real democracy, not FPTP, winner takes all, tyranny of the majority. You said it yourself that Westminster is fucked.

  If this movement were emotive why would it be supported by everyone from anarchists, communists, socialists, and social democrats? Populism hasn’t been the tactic of engaging the population, as would be expected from an emotive issue. Rational reasoning has, which is why it’s garnered support from a broad spectrum of centrists to leftists.

  Maybe think on where you get your information about independence, what biases you’re exposed to, what opinions you’re hearing from colleagues and friends who have no stake or say in the matter but will provide an opinion anyway. Ignore the fucking BBC on this matter, they are not impartial.

  Return to my previous comment and click the link at the bottom. Read. And get your head out your arse for dismissing an entire political movement which has had widespread support since 2007 (breaking a proportionally representative system’s expectation of no majorities) as just an emotive issue.

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  • hellothere@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

    Christ alive.

    I completely agree my home town is fucked, it’s part of the reason I left. My point re Barnett is that Holyrood gets additional money from Westminster for all the cash it spaffs in London, while the bit a few miles south of the border I now live in doesn’t and has all the same problems.

    I’m a massive supporter of devolution and local decision making, and a lot more powers - especially tax raising - do need to be devolved.

    Yes a lot has changed since 2014, but where you are drawing the lines on the map to decide whether something is ours or theirs is something to consider.

    It’s clear that you think an independent Scotland would benefit from oil wealth - I’d agree, if for no other reason than I can’t see Holyrood selling off the drilling rights to their executive mates in BP and Shell - but if the central belt votes for independence, and everywhere else doesn’t, but due to population distribution the overall vote is Yes…well, then what?

    Is that self determination?

    Or is the same madness we saw with brexit, of majority rule forcing everyone else to follow them?

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    • Zombie@feddit.uk ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

      Holyrood doesn’t get additional money though. That’s my point. Barnett is a scam. Even the BBC’s ex Economics Editor, Stephanie Flanders, concluded that Scotland breaks even. That’s somebody who is staunchly against independence and had a high level position in an organisation which was proven to have had an anti-independence bias.

      youtu.be/yqGGriEJac8

      If that’s her analysis, with all of her biases, what do you think the reality is? What do you think the situation is now, now that we’re 12 years on from then, with advancements in renewables and Scotland’s geography being incredibly good for wind, tidal, and hydro power? With water becoming a scarcer and scarcer resource, and Loch Ness alone holding more water than England and Wales’ rivers and lakes combined?

      The line has been drawn for as long as anybody who is alive has known. Scotland, England, and Wales have had well defined borders for quite some time. If the north of England wishes to join a Scottish independence movement then fair enough, but they’ve made no real manoeuvres for such a move.

      What if Aberdeen declares independence? What if East Kilbride declares independence? You’re getting into silly reductionism now. Holyrood has always argued it’s a matter of self determination and has no military means with which to force any regions, so what do you think would happen? Do you think John Swinney will ride into Fraserburgh on a tank while Russell Findlay fires artillery at him? Or do you think a proportionally representative parliament would hash something out? Holyrood, being proportional, doesn’t have the issue of a tyranny of the majority.

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      • hellothere@sh.itjust.works ⁨1⁩ ⁨day⁩ ago

        You’re getting into silly reductionism now.

        To an extent, but, it’s only silly because of where you draw the line compared to where someone else might.

        Going back to the ref results, the borders in general had some of the highest No votes. Border psychology is a fascinating thing, and what you usually see in countries with adversarial relationships is an increasing level of self-identification and expressed difference, rather than less. People in Hawick not wanting to lynch every bastard from Otterburn is - internationally speaking - a rarity.

        I guess my point overall is that Westminster absolutely need reform, FPTP needs to be fucked off, as do the Lords, and we need to move to a much more federalist system with substantial devolution. A Union of Equals would also mean that English regions get the same levels of devolution, and if we did that on population there would be 10 of those, plus Wales and NI.

        But I think we also need to seriously pay attention to the lessons we’ve learnt from Brexit. Barriers to trade are a fucking nightmare. As are trade negotiations. The majority of Scotland’s total trade is to rUK, much like how the UK’s trade was to EU. In a dynamic where you’re the smaller market exporting to a larger market, you’re in a weaker negotiating position. Political, maybe spiteful, reasons give the other block reasons to drag their feet. Disentangling laws over 50 years take forever, 400 even more so.

        I sincerely don’t believe that independence meaningfully improves Scotland’s position or abilities in the world. Let’s assume an independent Scotland is allowed to immediately rejoin the EU, by pretty much any measure it would be in the middle of the pack, around the same position as Slovakia, Bulgaria, Hungary, that sorta thing.

        Have a look at EU policy, what is decided, even with a more (but still pretty bad) proportional system, where money is spent, who has the most influence, etc, and I don’t see how that would be a meaningful improvement.

        But that’s just where I draw my particular line - give me a federal UK within a federal EU, and I’d be content.

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