Comment on What’s a movie nobody can convince you is good?
moakley@lemmy.world 3 weeks agoIf it follows a standard story structure, then what was the climax?
I think I’m very open-minded about movies. For example in the mid-aughts I dragged my girlfriend to like five different Coen Brothers movies before I decided that I really just don’t like them. For another example, I even like mainstream movies.
Isn’t it possible I do understand it, and I just don’t like it? I’ve put enough thought into it. I see the themes. I don’t think those things outweigh the poor plot structure.
You can say No Country has a coherent plot, but it doesn’t in the sense I’m talking about.
TheDorkfromYork@lemm.ee 3 weeks ago
Skimming through the movie, I would say about 1 hour 39 minutes into the movie is the climax. The Sheriff enters the hotel Llewelyn was murdered in, not knowing if Anton is there. In the previous scene the local cop told him that Anton showed up two nights in a row to the scene of the crime, and the Sheriff went in knowing this. Every choice comes with risk. He took his final chance and survived, but not in tact.
When the movie starts, the Sheriff talks admirably of old cop stories, before saying; “I always knew you had to be willing to die to even do this job, but I don’t want to push my chips forward and go out and meet something I don’t understand. A man would have to put his soul at hazard. He would have to say, ok. I’ll be part of this world.”
By the end, everyone told him times have changed, except Uncle Ellis who says it has always been this way. People die, the world is chaos. Everyone is one coin flip away from death, even Anton who suffers a car accident no fault of his own. People frequently mischaracterize Anton as the manifestation of death, but he’s not; he manifestation of chance. I picked up on this on a rewatched when he missed a shot on a still bird.
The Sheriff tells of the dream he had of his father going ahead, to prepare a fire for when he got there, before then waking up. To me, he has awoken to the truth; there is no justice, no happy endings, every has their time, and it’s a fools work to worry about it, but he’s now a lost man.
Rewatch the movie with this in mind, and I think you’ll enjoy it far more.
moakley@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
That’s the worst climax ever.
It’s supposed to be the turning point of the story, where the conflict is resolved.
You’re saying the actual story is this old man who’s barely in the movie realizing that life sucks. And this point in the story, where literally nothing happens on screen, is the resolution of the conflict of him not exactly realizing that life sucks.
Ugh. That’s not complex or deep. It’s oblique and pretentious.
The definition of a climax is “the most intense, exciting, or important point of something; a culmination or apex.”
That scene is obviously not intense or exciting. It’s only the most important part of this hidden plotline that’s even more off-screen than Llewelyn’s death since it only takes place in the mind of a character who’s barely in the movie, who has no agency and no part of the actual events shown on screen.
It’s insufferable. The things you’re saying (which I was already aware of, to be clear) make the movie worse, not better.
Even if I was super into this extremely boring theme, it doesn’t preclude the rest of the movie from containing a well-told story. And even if I went into the movie convinced that the Coens are geniuses and ready to forgive every other thing, voiceover exposition talking about symbolism-laden dreams is always going to be lazy writing.
I won’t watch it again. I’m not trying to reevaluate it. I didn’t miss anything. I just don’t think it’s any good.
TheDorkfromYork@lemm.ee 3 weeks ago
You still don’t get it lol. In 5 years you’re going to feel silly about this whole thing when it clicks.
All scenes built up to that moment. You didn’t notice it.
All themes are boring if you write them down. Movies justify themes.
I rewatched the movie last night, and every scene is critical. It is an very focused script. Each scene creates the next.
If you started watching that scene without the context of the rest of the film, you would say nothing happens.
I went water skiing with some friends a few months ago. One of their sons couldn’t figure it out. He blamed the waves to the speed of the boat or the skis. He wouldn’t admit he was wrong and would get angry at us for trying to help.
My impression is that you continue to not understand the movie. If you did understand it, even if you disliked it, you would still appreciate how tight the script is, or how realistic the action is at least, or to understand how a character with less screen time could be the focus of the story. I meant it when I said in 5 years something will click and you’ll get it.
moakley@lemmy.world 3 weeks ago
It is extremely clear to me that you’re the one who isn’t getting it. Nice discussing it with you though.