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The original was posted on /r/soccer by /u/AnnieIWillKnow on 2023-08-01 10:56:36.
It is that time of year again, when the /r/soccer Mod Team opens the floor to the community, for our Summer Meta Thread.
As always, you are welcome to discuss any meta topic, but there are a few issues in particular we would like feedback on.
In the body of this post, we also want to provide some updates on a few key meta issues in recent months - and will issue a further update following this thread.
Recent meta threads have followed a format in which we put this thread into competition mode, and the key topics as top level comments. We ask that you reply with the relevant comment with your feedback relating to that issue. Any other top level comments will be removed.
| Key discussion topics |
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Transfer talk:
As always, and especially at this time of year, how transfer news is moderated is a key issue in the subreddit.
Since last summer, we have adopted a policy (specified in the submission guidelines) of “one post per day per saga” - unless there are several significant developments. What constitutes a “significant” update is subjective, of course.
We think this generally works well - we have had complaints about more fast-developing with numerous updates, in which this approach has felt too restrictive. As such, we have tried to take a more flexible approach.
For example: if a rumour is posted, and subsequently a different source posts de-bunking it, we would allow both posts - and leave it to the community to decide who they choose to believe. Before deciding this, we had removed some of the de-bunking posts - but have realised subsequently this is not the best way.
We are currently undertaking an internal review of our guidelines relating to transfer submissions, and working to make this clearer in our submission guidelines - so would welcome community feedback to help aid this.
To clarify re an off-asked question regarding “tiers”:
Unless blatantly a false source, we avoid arbitrating on reliability - preferring to let the community decide with upvotes/downvotes/comments in the thread. We do not have a tier system in /r/soccer, as although it can work well for club subreddits, the variability in reliability between journalists and clubs means we feel it would be near-impossible to have an overall tier system (one journalist could be Tier 1 for one club, and Tier 3 for another). We also think that allowing a tier system would mean that comments would focus on the tier system itself rather than the substance of the transfer rumour.
One potential change could be using AutoMod to sticky a comment in every transfer post, in which users offer their views on the reliability of the source.
Major tournament moderation:
Following feedback from the community, and our own internal discussions about recent major tournaments, we consciously adopted a ‘hardline’ approach to the 2022 World Cup.
This consisted of a tougher-than-ever stance on xenophobia (which breeds toxicity and damages discourse) - and increasing our account age and karma thresholds to enable users to comment on /r/soccer threads, to filter out trolls and bad faith users. Following the tournament, we relaxed these thresholds back down to the normal levels. This was to help manage with the influx of non-regular users, many of whom do not come to the subreddit in good faith for major tournaments.
We also diversified our moderation team, in order to gain a broader variety of perspectives as a mod team - as well as recruiting some temporary mods to assist with the increased workload during the tournament.
Furthermore, we began sticking match threads, as requested for major tournaments.
Overall, we felt this went well, and were able to learn a lot. We felt that the subreddit was less toxic than during the 2018 World Cup, and the Euros in 2021. We will likely take a similar approach to future tournaments - and would also like your feedback on how the experience was for you.
Daily threads - and Free Talk Friday’s start time
Currently, Free Talk Friday is posted at 9am UTC.It had previously been at 12pm UTC - and was moved to an earlier slot in response to frequent community requests.
What do you think of the current start time - would you like it to be posted later again, or to see it on a rotating time slot to cater to different time zones?
We are always seeking ideas for new daily stickied threads. We can have a maximum of two at any one time, meaning in addition to the Daily Discussion Thread, there is one spot a day available.
Currently Tuesday and Thursday are our rotational slots - with Monday Moan, the Non PL Daily Discussion Thread, Free Talk Friday, and Sunday Support considered non-negotiables.
One suggestion is of a “At The Match Saturday” thread - for talk focused on matchday experiences. We currently have the Non PL Daily Discussion Thread stickied on Saturdays, and would be loath to discourage the community there - so an idea could be to rotate with this.
Please let us know if you have any thoughts or suggestions.
Moderation of the Daily Discussion Thread
Over the past year, we have adjusted how we moderate the Daily Discussion Thread. We have shifted towards a stricter stance, in order to try and improve the quality of discourse - in response to community feedback.
This includes stricter moderation of troll and bait comments (especially repeat offenders), using AutoMod to remove certain trigger phrases, and a minimum character count.
We have also started more strongly enforcing the rule of “not using the DDT as a match thread” - a frequent complaint from users. As such, these comments are now removed whenever possible, with escalating to temporary bans for persistent offenders. This is a clear policy, and one which will be enforced.
Finally, we would also like to reiterate our rule on keeping meta discussion out of the DDT. This is because it derails discussion, and can lead to harassment. If you have queries over moderation or post removals, we ask that you contact the mods via Modmail.
| Clarification from the Mod Team on a few key issues… |
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Reddit blackout, in response to API changes
As we are sure many are aware, numerous subreddits recently participated in a “blackout” - in response to the Reddit admins’ planned changes to their API system, which impacted many third-party applications people use to browse the site. A summary of the issue can be found here.
We conducted a meta thread and held an opinion poll, in order to gauge a consensus on whether we should participate in what was then a planned 48-hour blackout.
There was a strong consensus in that thread and poll in support of the 48-hour blackout - and an indefinite blackout, if required. We therefore proceeded with the 48-hour blackout as we believed that was representative of the community’s view. 6,000 users voted in the poll, with nearly 90% in favour of the blackout.
We may have been naive in how we extrapolated, but in good faith we believed that was representative due to the strength of opinion - and was the best metric we had to guide the decision.
The subsequent course of action was one which caused considerable debate amongst us, internally. Our priority was what was the overall best for the community - and we wanted to strike a balance between concerns of users over changes, and maintaining the subreddit as the forum we have grown together over these years (as a broadly decent place to discuss football).
There were concerns of admins taking over certain subreddits if they did not re-open (which they have since gone on to do). We did not believe the Reddit admins (who lack the same understanding of the sport or our community) running the subreddit would be of benefit overall, either.
Although we had a ‘mandate’ from initial poll to continue indefinitely, we did not want to take such a decision without rediscussing with the community - as we recognised that people whose voice had not been heard before would now probably have something to say, or views may have changed
Hence, we re-opened the subreddit to discuss whether to continue the blackout - and a strong alternative consensus emerged to re-open the subreddit. We therefore did what our overall intention was - what we felt was best for the community as a majority, based on the discussions we had had with the users and between ourselves (over many hours and literally 1000s of Discord messages).
We at no point were ever going to impose our rule on the matter - and as a mod team, there was healthy discussion both for and against the blackout, indefinite or otherwise.
It was a time of a lack of clarity, and strong opinion from both sides - hopefully the above explanation shines some light on how we took the decisions we did, even if they are not ones you agree with.
Rising anti-Saudi Arabia and anti-Arab sentiment
The recent expansion of the Saudi Pro League further in the world of football has been a big recent topic of discussion in this subreddit and elsewhere.
It has led to much debate relating to complex issues - such as sportswashing, and human rights. These are valid points of discussion, and we have long welcomed this discourse on the subreddit.
However, as these topics have become more prevalen…
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